In a previous post, I re-visited Raymond Brown’s article on Jewish Christianity and found myself in agreement with the idea that the Christian church is rooted in Judaism. While it is popular enough to emphasize the “Jewishness” of Jesus or Paul, there is dissent in describing the roots of Christianity as “Jewish.”
Jacob Neusner, for example, does not believe that there is a common foundation for both Judaism and Christianity. Neusner states that “Judaisms and Christianities never meet anywhere. That is because at no point do Judaism, defined by Torah, and Christianity, defined by the Bible, intersect” (p. xi). He contrasts Christians and Pharisees as an example of this absolute disconnect. Both Pharisees and Christians “belong to Israel,” Neusner says, but they had completely different definitions of “Israel” to the point that they could not even have dialogue. Christians say “Israel” as salvation, while Pharisees saw “Israel” as a way of life (3-4). Christianity is all about salvation (in the next life), while the Pharisees is all about sanctification (in this life).
His point is well taken, since Judaism is not as much interested in salvation “out of this world and into heaven” but rather living out God’s will in this life. But in a typically Neusnerian fashion, he makes this dichotomy so strong that the two cannot be said to have any common ground. In my view, he is taking Christianity as we know it from the fourth century and later as his model of what “Christianity is” and (rightly) judging it as having little or nothing in common with Judaism.
This is a problem for many studies of the first-century church. There is an assumption that the earliest believers in Jesus were somehow more correct in their doctrine and practice than later generations. I cannot agree with this, since the earliest believers hardly worked out the implications of who Jesus claimed to be let alone the what effect the Christ Event would have on “Israel.” They were Jewish people who believe Jesus was the Messiah and that salvation only comes through him. In practice, there was as much diversity as there was in Judaism at the time. While James was welcome in the Temple courts, Peter and John were tolerated there, but Stephen and the Hellenists likely were not welcome. All were Jewish and would likely consider themselves the correct continuation of Jesus’ ministry.
It is not until Paul’s letters that there is a serious attempt to understand Jesus’ death and resurrection and the implications that these events have for Israel. For Paul, the people of God are a family (like Jesus taught), but also the Body of Christ. Neusner correctly picks up on this and sees this as a dividing point between Christianity and the Pharisees as well. Paul says that whatever the people of God are, they are a unique group apart from Israel.
Bibliography: Jacob Neusner, Jews and Christians: The Myth of the Common Tradition. Classics in Judaic Studies. New York: Binghamton University, 2001. Originally published by Trinity International, 1991. The 2001 edition has a 40 page preface written for that printing.
I really appreciate the blog post. Thank you for sharing and keep up the excellent work.
Reblogged this on Talmidimblogging.
It’s an odd usage of Myth in Neusner’s title, appealing to the true/false axis rather than the story/truth axis.
I’t hard to know where to start with the problems in this sentence: (I corrected say to saw) “Christians saw “Israel” as salvation, while Pharisees saw “Israel” as a way of life (3-4)”.
It seems to me that Christians without sanctification, i.e. without action seeking the holy and the good in the present age and life, are impossible to believe ultimately. The way of life is critical to salvation (whatever that means).
I am tempted to say, “well, that’s Neusner for you.” Post-WW2 Christian scholars have sought the origins of Christianity in Judaism (and properly so), Neusner is trying to reign in that trend.
Probably a big problem with Neusner looking at Christianity is that he mostly came in contact with trinitarians and did not come to know enough unitarian Christians.
The earliest believers in Jesus never took him to be God, but accepted that he was the sent one from god, a prophet and master teacher, who was taken out of the dead to become a high priest for God and a mediator between God and man.
This will always be an open question, since the earliest Jewish writer we have on Jesus is Paul, and he has a rather high Christology. Philippians 2:5-11, for example, exalts Jesus to divine, and it may reflect a worship tradition pre-dating Paul’s letter. I would be happier with “not all earliest believers in Jesus never took him to be God” than dismissing the Pauline witness.
If you refer to the disciples of Jesus prior to the resurrection, you are of course correct. No one worshiped Jesus as God until after the resurrection and ascension.
It is likely the case that describing anyone as “trinitarian” or “unitarian” Christians is anachronistic since that kind of language is current until we get closer to Nicea.
I started reading this book called, TORAH! TORAH! TORAH! by Peter Thalhofer, in his acknowledgment the pastor he grew up learning the Bible from stated, “Israel had the Gospel centuries before Jesus’ ministry.” This statement had me thinking more about my life as a believer and how or what can I learn through Judaism through Christ Jesus. Jesus said, “Do not think I have come to abolish the Law or the prophets, I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them (Matt. 5:17, NIV).” Furthermore, if Jesus is the New Covenant with the old covenant in him, because what he said in Matthew 5:17, does this mean both the Written Torah and the living Torah is made one but different concept meaning? This blog, now has me wanting to search more and get a good understanding and knowledge to help me put pieces together both Old and new of the Bible. From following the Torah to God writing the Torah in our hearts.
The premise of this article – the validity of Jewish Christianity – surprised me.
After some consideration, I realized that I have so strongly associated Jewish history with Christianity that I considered nothing else.
The post highlights the work of Jacob Neusner. From the article, it seems that Neusner believes that Christianity and Judaism are distinctly separate groups One of his supporting arguments notes that they have different Holy books – one the Bible, the other the Torah. While they are separate the Torah, in my opinion, is part of the Christian Bible. The Bible is not the Torah, nor is the Torah the Bible. Yet I would not go as far as to agree with Neusner that the two never interact. Even in the New Testament, selections and quotations from the Torah are present. An argument could also be formed that the Bible cannot be properly understood without a knowledge of the Torah.
That being said, I am left with the question: What is the Torah? Or more accurately, how would Neusner define the Torah? Good research contains working definitions. In this article and in my response I’ve taken the assumption that the Torah indicates the Pentateuch. Whether or not it is a correct assumption is to be determined.
If Neusner is in fact, referring to the collective of the books Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, and Deuteronomy, I would struggle to agree with his main premise.
I do however, find this blog article helpful in better and more accurately understanding the distinctiveness of Judaism and Christianity.
“Judaism is not as much interested in salvation ‘out of this world and into heaven’ but rather living out God’s will in this life.” This sentence caught my eye. I think as Christians we see our salvation as a free pass to do what we want. It’s true, if we’re saved, we’re going to Heaven, but it is important that we don’t take God’s salvation for granted–that we focus on living out God’s will in this life. What is our purpose? What can I do for God in this life? I think as Christians, we tend to forget to live out God’s will for our lives.
I believe it to be a bit bold of Neusner to say that Christianity and Judaism do not share any common ground. I understand what he may be trying to claim but to go as far as to say that there is no commonality? I’m not sure that we can claim that here. I agree that Christians in the 1st century were fundamentally different than the Pharisees of the time, sanctification versus salvation. Works versus faith. Christianity draws much from that though. We see in 2 Thessalonians 2:13 that sanctification comes only through the work of the Holy Spirit and no longer through the abiding of the Law (Exodus 31:13). 1st century Jewish Christians, still practicing Jewish law, looked much the same as their law-abiding, temple-worshipping, Jewish brothers and sisters that did not hold to Jesus as the Messiah. The Torah was included in scripture for a purpose, and as far as I know Neusner does not properly address this commonality and its significance.
I often look at 1st century Christians as having it figured out. They had disagreements and arguments about doctrinal issues but for the most part they seemed to be functioning as one church, just in many places. But I see that I was in error here. The early Christian churches looked much like the American church in that it had many different doctrinal and practicing beliefs. Division between Jewish Christians and Gentile Christians I would imagine caused many different opinions on practices. Those not familiar with the law would see no place for it, and those raised in the practice of the law would not have just let it go.
I have also very much thought that the people that knew Christ were the ones to listen to more in the Bible than people like Paul who are speaking after the fact. After reading this article I stand corrected because Romans 9:24-27 means more to me than a lot of other verses in the Bible. That is because it states I get to be saved if I chose to be. I no longer have to be an Israelite. Paul also states that God’s people are christians and not just the people of Israel.
We look at the roots of Christianity in Judaism to be a possibility. Before proceeding, I’d like to take a moment and look at the surface of what Christianity and Judaism are. I believe it is important to recognize the differences and commonalities of Christianity and Judaism. We understand at the core of both is God, but it is expressed differently. Individuals practicing Judaism focus more on fulfilling God’s will here on earth. Christianity, however, focuses on the salvation being a gift that is sufficient over our actions. That’s not saying we do not practice living God’s will, it just is not the defining focus of our relationship with God. When we recognize the surface of how they are practiced today we get an understanding of their focus. This is not enough to decide if they are rooted in each other. The context tells us both come from the same place, Israel. Neusner makes a point that their Israel’s are different. At the same time, I think it’s important to realize these individuals grew up during the same time or their ancestors did. Generations came through learning more about what Jesus’ life meant to them, over time these views became different and expanded to new ways of thinking. Our textbook touches on this too as it talks about how much easier it would be if Jesus wrote us a systematic theology book, but instead, others were inspired to do so (Jobe, 2011, pp.13). It takes time for others to write and talk about who Jesus was and the way of life, so the beginning churches would not have had a clear picture. Overall, it is interesting to recognize the commonalities and differences in the roots of Christianity and Judaism.
This was a great passage to read with Jewish Christianity “A Myth” by Raymond Brown the article was very useful to me as I learn more about the Christian world. In the passage it said that “Judaism is not as much interested in salvation out of this world and into heaven but rather living out God’s will in this life.” It caught my eye because us as God children and we know he always forgive us because that what he died for some time we take it overboard because and feel that we can Sin and do what we want because God will overlook that. I don’t think we do it on purpose but that something that us Christians need to work on to become better for God’s Kingdom.
“Christianity is all about salvation in the next life, whereas Pharisees is all about sanctification in this life”(P.Long). With the Pharisees, it was more important to be a good person than to have strong beliefs. There was more of a focus upon what others think opposed to what God thinks. This comes from Judaism being less focused on Salvation but more focused on working out salvation during one’s life, the two are not allowed to have a common ground. Pharisees and Christian both believe in Israel and the resurrection; however, they do not share the same interpretation of the two. Pharisees are more focused on having a good life, whereas Christians are more focused on having a good afterlife. Pharisees also appear to be more selfish, as the things they do are for personal gain, to show that they are good. Christians are loving and compassionate out of the love they receive from God.
The early church did not understand the implications of Christ. This knowledge does not come until the later generations of Christians. Both Jews and Christians were a continuation of Jesus’ ministry, as long as the Jews were believers of Jesus Christ. Today, these Jews are referred to as ‘Messiac Jews.’ However, although both are continuations of Jesus’ ministry, it is important to remember that the two entities are different from each other.
I agree with Paul that the people of God are a family because just as Jesus has talked about throughout the Bible, we are children of God and that makes us part of His family (1 John 3:1-2). I don’t think that the easiest believers were more correct with there practice than later generations. In our world today we have a lot more people who have accepted Christ and are following Jesus. If anything, the latest generations might me more correct to a certain degree because we have the documents and we have the Bible to show us how people were back in the Bible days and those actions are mimicked by us today whether they are good actions or bad actions.
As posted on the blog, Jacob Neusner wrote the book Jews and Christians the Myth of a Common Tradition which explains Neusner’s belief that there is not a common foundation for both Judaism and Christianity. The Bible and the Torah do not intersect. He uses the comparison of Christians and Pharisees as an example because they both “belong to Israel,” but Christians saw Israel as a salvation, whereas Pharisees saw it as a way of life. Judaism is not focused so much on salvation “out of this world and into heaven” but rather what they are doing in this life. Due to the strong beliefs of both Judaism and Christianity, that are unwavering, the two are unable to find a common ground. Neusner takes the fourth century view of Christianity and describes what is and how it has nothing to do with Judaism.
The assumption that first century Christians have the most correct view in their doctrine compared to the later generations is challenged when Paul preaches the depths of the understanding of Jesus’ death and resurrection. Paul’s view is that the people of God are like what God describes, a family (John 1:12). Paul even goes as far to believe that whatever Followers of Jesus may be considered, “they are a unique group apart from Israel.”
The claim that Judaism and Christianity have no intersection seems off to me because of the idea that you (P. Long) mentioned as the assumption that we have about those first believers; that they were more correct about theology than any other time. While they had experienced God Himself walking among them, they still had not worked out some very important doctrines yet. To add to your post, one book of the Bible that demonstrates this strongly is Hebrews. First, according to Jobes in Letters to the Church, Hebrews explains the importance of Jesus as also fully man (2011). This indicates that it was not commonly understood until this letter was written, around 60-70 AD (Jobes, 2011). Second, Hebrews explains how the old covenant has been fulfilled and that there is a new covenant to Christians who should know better, or even “by this time … ought to be teachers” (Heb. 5:12)! This, again, indicated that seasoned Christians did not understand that the old law had been fulfilled through Jesus Christ and that there was no need to return to it. Therefore, it’s important to recognize the intersection between Judaism and Christianity. The early Christians were deeply saturated in Judaism, after all, the apostle Paul was a Pharisee (Acts 23:6)! They still had much to consider about Christianity outside of their own culture, it was not an overnight transition. And the idea that Hebrews lays out, going from the old covenant to the new, indicates another entwinement between Judaism and Christianity. When Christians understand more about Judaism, we can better understand Christianity.
From the reading and the blog post there is a statement that says “Judaisms and Christianities never meet anywhere” and I feel as though this can have an alternate argument with this in my own opinion. When Neusner says that they had different definitions of Israel where Christians are all about salvation and Pharisees were all about sanctification, they both are actually pretty much the same, in the sense that they are still living in a way that God wants. They both want the love from God, whether that is in the afterlife, or while in this life, but in the essence, they are still practicing to know God, know why he does what he does, why he came into human form, why God sacrificed his one and only son, in this, they are both worshiping a God and hoping to gain salvation either in this life or the heaven life. A quote you also said that supports my argument is the fact for Paul that the people of God are a family, just like the ways Jesus taught, and in this, Christianity and Judaism are in God’s eyes family, even though they may have a different view. They can still come together and worship the one true God that we have, because as John says, whatever the people of God are, they are still a part of Israel, which I agree with. Saying that they would never meet anywhere is in my eyes not true because in God’s eyes they should put their opinions aside and still worship God.
I thought that it was a very interesting concept to think of Judaism and Christianity as completely separate because they do worship the same God and have similar beliefs. But thinking about it further, many of the Jewish Christians of this time still believed that they had to obey the Law and that just because they believed in Christ who had come to save them did not mean that they could suddenly eat bacon, to them this was still a sin. But to Gentiles coming into Christianity at this time they had no food laws and so they had no problem eating pig products and “unclean” meats. This caused much dissension as we see on page 12 of the Jewish Christian Literature notes, “As persecution increased the more the ‘parting of the ways’ became important to the Jews in order to avoid persecution”(PLong, 12). This parting of the ways is what continued to separate Jewish Christians from Gentile Christians. I think that Neusner is trying to make a big point by saying that Judaism and Christianity do not share common ground, because they do; they both sprout from the same beginnings but one side(Judaism) believes in the sanctity of the Law whereas the other side(Gentile) do not believe that because they did not have to obey those laws from the beginning.
From what I understand, the center of Christianity is the message of salvation through God’s justification seen in Jesus, the Son of God acting as an atoning sacrifice for the sins of mankind (Romans 5:8-10). The differences between Judaism and Christianity are very clear, however to say that there is absolutely no foundation or connection between the two religions is quite a bold statement. I can see where Neusner is coming from in this statement. Judaism isn’t as interested in salvation and their ideas of “Israel” are very different but I would have to agree with Professor Long and Raymond Brown when they say that Christianity is rooted in Judaism (Long, 2018). We can see that through the general epistles, authors were expressing their concerns of the distorted and improper understanding that Jews had of the nature of Jesus (Kobes, 2011). Could this be an explanation behind why Judaism and Christianity are so distinct? If the nature of Jesus is distorted, then it is obvious that misconceptions will arise, and could explain the split in theological beliefs. We can see that many of the prophets and apostles, even Jesus himself were in fact Jews and followed Jewish laws and traditions (Long, 2018). So the split between Judaism and Christianity could have been a result of misunderstanding, or the more obvious one, not believing in Jesus’ testimony as the Son of God. The general epistles tried to explain to Jews and clarify that salvation could be found in Jesus. The old covenants were no longer necessary, and given the importance and tradition of these covenants within Jewish theology, I could see where Jews would have a hard time accepting a new message (Kobes, 2011). However, even though there were those who didn’t agree, there were those like the author of Hebrews who wrote letters and sermons expressing this new way of living as one to be followed (Kobes, 2011). Paul expresses that we are now the Body of Christ, a family of believers given the gift of salvation and capable of living through the example of Jesus, making them distinct from anyone else (Long, 2018).
Jobes, K. H. (2011). Letters To The Church: A Survey of Hebrews and the General Epistles. Zondervan.
The main idea from this post is: How can we describe the roots of Christianity to be Jewish? After reading the blog post by Long, it is safe to say that Jacob Neusner thinks with all certainty that there is no connection between Christianity and Judaism. Long quotes “That is because at no point do Judaism, defined by Torah, and Christianity, defined by the Bible, intersect”. (Long, 2018) It should be known though that both the Pharisees and the Christians did both come from Israel. In Neusner’s thoughts, it is also clear that even though they both came from Israel, they had different beliefs of what Israel meant to them. Pharisees saw Israel as pertaining to their current life, while Christians had ideas and beliefs about the afterlife. Neusner is sure that both of these groups of people are completely different and disconnected from each other. I think that this statement is pretty bold as there might be a slight connection between them. It is clear that the first century Christian beliefs differed from the Pharisees but they both are focused on God. Their ideas and practices were just much different. Judaism focuses on how to fulfill God while we are here on this earth while Christianity focuses on salvation. How do we get to be with the Lord after we die on this earth? That life really starts once we are with God. What is interesting is that we cannot, as Christians, just purely focus on salvation but we also have to be fulfilling to God on this earth. We want to be examples of Christ. Both sets of these people lived their lives according to what they thought was pleasing to God. Whether they grew up around the same times, they both had their own beliefs. This would go on from generations to generations. So, yes, they did come with different “roots”, but I think it is safe to say that they both came from God.
Neusner holds firmly that Judaism and Christianity never meet anywhere or intersect, and I would have to disagree with him seeing that the first five books of the Bible is the Torah.
Having read this post as well as the post referencing Raymond Brown’s Types of Jewish Christianity, it became clear to me that there have been multiple views and practices of Christianity, perhaps “denominations”, since it started. It is so interesting to read about these possible subgroups of the early Christian church.
You mentioned how there is an assumption that the earliest believers in Jesus were somehow more correct in their doctrine and practice than later generations, to which you disagree with. I don’t know if that is assumed because the earlier believers may have literally walked with Jesus, therefore had direct answers to their question. Or perhaps because their gatherings, as we see in the Acts 2 church, were “simpler” than the practices and gatherings of later generation believers. It is not to say that one generation is better or more holy than another, but the fact is that, as you stated, the earliest believers had hardly worked out the doctrines Christianity or who Jesus truly was and claimed to be.
I think it comes down to Paul’s teachings of being one family, one body, under the headship of Christ. He says in Galatians 3 that before faith came, there was the law, which was our guardian before Christ. But now that Christ has come, there is justification by faith alone… “for in Christ Jesus you are ALL sons of God, through faith. For as many of you were baptized into Christ have put on Christ. There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus,”. The only distinction and identity to be held on to is that of belong to Christ.
This might be a good example of trying to bracket out what we know about the church from the Pauline letters. Hebrews through Revelation never really describes the church as a body, maybe not even as a family.
Interesting points! There might be a possibility that Christianity leads back to Judaism. I believe that both can overlap. Jobes states “the story of Jesus’ life, death and resurrection had to be told to audiences that included Jews, with their knowledge of God’s ancient work in the world.” (p.4). I also agree with you (P.Long), I don’t agree with the assumption that the earliest believers were more correct in their doctrine. In the Gospels, there are various accounts where the people were seeing miracles and still not believing in Jesus. If we look at 1 Corinthians, Paul wrote to the believers who weren’t living out their faith and doctrines. The first believers were accepting the fact that Jesus was sent by God, but they weren’t really understanding the reason for His resurrection. Reflecting on that, it can be convicting for us because even now we might be like the early believers. We know that God sent Jesus to take on humanity with the ultimate purpose of Salvation. But do we understand what Salvation is? What does Salvation mean to us? “Christianity is all about salvation (in the next life)” (P.Long). In my opinion, both of these religions have many differences and similarities but ultimately they lead back to God.
Interesting points! There might be a possibility that Christianity leads back to Judaism. I believe that both can overlap. Jobe states “the story of Jesus’ life, death and resurrection had to be told to audiences that included Jews, with their knowledge of God’s ancient work in the world.” (p.4). I also agree with you (P.Long), I don’t agree with the assumption that the earliest believers were more correct in their doctrine. In the Gospels, there are various accounts where the people were seeing miracles and still not believing in Jesus. If we look at 1 Corinthians, Paul wrote to the believers who weren’t living out their faith and doctrines. The first believers were accepting the fact that Jesus was sent by God, but they weren’t understanding the reason for His resurrection. Reflecting on that can be convicting for us because even now we might be like the early believers. We know that God sent Jesus to take on humanity with the ultimate purpose of Salvation. Do we understand what Salvation is? What does Salvation mean to us? “Christianity is all about salvation (in the next life)” (P.Long). Both of these religions have differences and similarities but ultimately they lead back to God.
When you mentioned that Neusner does not believe there is a common foundation for both Judaism and Christianity I can agree with this to some extent. There is room for a common foundation for both religious groups though it’s simple one still has to acknowledge that it’s present. Though the connection between the two is a fine line I would say that it’s the most important. Jews & Christians both find a commonality in monotheism and believing that Scripture holds an authoritative power. Now obviously so traditional Jews don’t put their faith in Christ, but they do everything they do believe in the same God we serve; they don’t worship any idols or but things above God. Their relationship with the Father is just as important to them as it would be to us. Now the fine line there is that God does mention multiple times there is going to be a redeemer sent to fulfill the law and this is where the common foundation gets misconstrued. Jew start to form a savior that is going to redeem them from political enslavement rather than spiritual bondage; though it’s important that Jews receive Christ and the New Covenant we cannot overlook the fact that we serve the same God with our monotheistic viewpoints. When it comes to the authority of Scripture Christians deem the OT and NT as being authoritative whereas the Jews only believe that the Torah is authoritative. But the common foundation of that is we both find that the Word of God is inspired and is to be followed correctly or there will be consequences. Being a Christian, these consequences are much different due to the fact that we have put our faith in Christ and accepted the New Covenant; rather than Jews who are still awaiting their deliverance and believe that Sheol is where they will be.
This is a very interesting blog post because the main idea that we can take away from this is the argument that arises when we look at the complete differences in regard to how both Christianity and Judaism view Israel. When we take a look at what Jacob Neusner has to say he holds firm that there is absolutely no connection between the two; stating “Judaism and Christianity never meet anywhere. That is because at no point do Judaism, defined by Torah, and Christianity, defined by the Bible, intersect” (P.Long) He backs his claim by adding “they had completely different definitions of “Israel” to the point that they could not even have dialogue. Christians say “Israel” as salvation, while Pharisees saw “Israel” as a way of life” (P.Long). I can agree with this statement because there should not be that big of a disconnect when it comes to what Israel means to the people. However, Judaism and Christianity come from different backgrounds and beliefs. It needs to make more sense and connect more. On the other end of the spectrum, I can disagree with Neusner because he states that nowhere in the Bible does Judaism and Christianity interest when clearly the first five books of the Bible are in relation with the Torah. Nonetheless, I respect what P. Long says at the end of this blog post stating that both Jews and Christians are God’s children no matter what one believes, and I personally think that it is a problem but in the end of the day we need to be on the same page in regard to justification and salvation and it is quite clear that there is a complete disconnect between Judaism and Christianity. With that being said, just like the authorship of Hebrews only God knows the intent and belief all of mankind, especially Jews, and Christians need to practice.
Ever since I started reading “Letters to the Church” and now this blog post, I have never thought about how Christianity and Judaism as completely separate, because they both believe in the same God and similar beliefs. I knew that they were different, but never thought of them as completely separate. It makes sense though because back in the time of this big question of if Gentile Christians needed to follow the law of the Jewish Christians. The Gentiles had no problem eating the “unclean” food and the Jewish Christians did because the Jewish Christians still saw it as a sin, even though Christ ultimately took that away. Judaism and Christianity are both strong and firm in what they believe and stand for, and therefore struggle to find common ground. I also liked at the very end you wrote how Paul talks about the people of Christ as a family. Even though so many of us have different views and beliefs we are still believing in God and serving him, and ultimately, we are family under God. Thank you for this post!
“Jacob Neusner, for example, does not believe that there is a common foundation for both Judaism and Christianity” (Long, 2018). As the first sentence of the blog that caught my eye, I think it’s presumptuous to believe that there exists no common ground whatsoever between the two. For example, the biggest issue of his argument relies on the fact that Christians and Pharisees weren’t the only two factions of the Judaic religion that existed at the time. A few well-read men above me also described the distinction between trinitarian and unitarian thought present within those qualified as “Jesus-followers” at the time – keenly, the disciples. Until Jesus Christ’s transfiguration and eventual ascension, they believed Him to be a prophetic representative of God who, much to the tune of Moses or Elijah, performed comparative “miracles” through God’s works. However, to argue Neusner’s point would be to ignore 1st-century Christian thought on the implications of Israel after the Christ event, the idea that Jewish ethnicity featured a diverse custom, the fact that believers nowadays are equally if not more (although, in select cases, also less) doctrinally sound than the ancients, and the concept of salvation as achieved by Christ – at least, in the Jewish letters like Hebrews – by placing the original framework, the Law, into a new context (Jobes, 2011, p. 9). There are simply too many contradictions that fall apart from hindsight.
“Judaism and Christianity never meet anywhere. That is because at no point do Judaism, defined by Torah, and Christianity, defined by the Bible, intersect” (Long, 2018). What would this author do about Jesus citing the Torah – Deuteronomy 6:13, 16; 8:3 – as every response to Satan in the wilderness? How does he deal with the Sermon on the Mount’s basis in the Law? As Everett Fox (1995) notes in his commentary on the Pentateuch, “This pattern is repeated when Yeshua quoted commandments concerning adultery (Exodus 20:14, Deuteronomy 5:18, Matthew 5:27), divorce (Matthew 5:31, Deuteronomy 24:1), and swearing falsely (Matthew 5:33, Numbers 30:2, Deuteronomy 23:21)” (p. 73). Jobes (2011) remarks that Hebrews specifically as a letter “presents who Jesus is and how he is the fulfillment of what God began to do through the nation of ancient Israel. . . Jesus Christ remains forever at the center of God’s relationship to mankind” (p. 53). Picking apart what amounts to veritable post-WWII Christian scholarship only denigrates the very message Christians are called to uphold and, as Long (2018) regards, “makes this dichotomy so strong that the two cannot be said to have any common ground.”
Some authors, like Jacob Neusner, argue that Jews and Christians do not share a common heritage, saying that at both tradition’s foundations lies an unbridgeable impasse that does not overlap. While I have much respect for scholars like Jacob Neusner, I think he is a representative of an older perspective within New Testament studies that might be best left behind as a vestige of previously dominant scholarship that maintains incorrect presuppositions. This presupposition assumes that the early movement of Jesus’ followers and perhaps Paul himself, saw themselves as leaving Judaism behind for the founding of this new religion. While this may be a rough summary, it tends to best illustrate why scholars such as Neusner see such a radical disconnect between both groups, as for him, differences between early believers and the Pharisees, among others, signal significant differences of understanding so radical that it does not permit overlap.
These assumptions, on their surface, seem to be challenged by the presence of Jewish believers in early ‘Christianity’, as many Jewish adherents followed Jesus and the continued observance of the law (Long, 11). Of course, this led to some issues for Paul, as some of these groups of ‘Judaizers’ argued that Gentile converts must be circumcised and follow the Law, leading to Paul arguing that one is not justified by works of the Law (Gal 2:16). Although, the presence of these issues itself signals that clearly some common foundation, even if misunderstood at times, is evidently present. This is also evident in the book of Acts, where early followers of Jesus are identified as ‘followers of the Way’ (Acts 24:14). The parting between this sect of Jewish believers in Jesus and the rest of Judaism may be partially in part because of political pressure, as some early believers in Jesus threatened to place Jews in legal trouble, presenting the possibility of their religious privileges to be taken away (Long, 12). The book of Hebrews serves as a strong rebuttal to Neusner’s argument, as it places Jesus and this early movement of followers strongly within the paradigms of Jewish religion, presenting Jesus as the High Priest and through His sacrifice came the New Covenant as proclaimed by the prophet Jeremiah. Lastly, this notion of a distinctive foundation for Christianity and Judaism is completely foreign to Paul, who was previously a zealous Pharisee before his experience on the road to Damascus. There’s no indication within Paul’s letters or the description of this experience in the book of Acts that this somehow disconnected him from his Jewish religious roots. Rather, it seems that Paul connected Jesus as the Jewish messiah and Lord, fulfilling the Law, inaugurating the beginning of the kingdom of God, and the apocalyptic coming together of heaven and earth (Eph 1:10). Of course, one shouldn’t take Paul’s statements that Gentiles did not need to be circumcised lightly, as this was a radical statement, but it also seems likely that throughout Paul’s life, he remained faithful to adhere to the Jewish law, simply positioning Gentiles in a unique position within this new movement within Judaism. The assertion that Christianity is about heaven while Judaism is earthly is an anachronistic statement more representative of later dualistic strands of Christian thought, not Paul or the early world of Jewish believers of Jesus.
This is a great response to this blog post. P. Longs post engages with Jacob Neusner’s perspective on the lack of a common foundation between Judaism and Christianity. It raises questions about the earliest Christian beliefs, acknowledging Paul’s role in shaping Christian theology. It also provides a good analysis of Neusner’s argument and its implications for understanding the relationship between Judaism and Christianity. Your response covers a lot of points. First, your thoughts on Neusner’s point of view. I agree with your perspective on his view being outdated. Next, your critique challenges that early followers of Jesus, including Paul, saw themselves as leaving Judaism behind to establish a new religion. This can be seen as outdated and/or problematic. I appreciate you challenging Neusner’s claim of an unbridgeable gap between Judaism and Christianity. Lastly, I totally agree with you that Christianity being about heaven while Judaism is earthly doesn’t reflect Paul or the early Jewish believers.
I am not entirely sure which side I land on regarding this topic, but many very interesting points were brought up throughout this post. P. Long used Jacob Neusner’s writing as an example,“Judaisms and Christianities never meet anywhere. That is because at no point do Judaism, defined by Torah, and Christianity, defined by the Bible, intersect” (p. xi). This statement to me comes across as a bit of an exaggeration, and I think that it is in some ways a bold claim as obviously Judaism and Christianity do share some similarities at face value. Historically speaking Christianity does arise from the Jewish nation in Israel, the catalyst of course being Jesus. While I know that this is addressed in the blog post as Israel means vastly different things between Jewish and Christian peoples. However, it can’t be denied that the earliest Christians were of course Jewish people prior to spreading to gentiles. While I understand the original statement to be describing a theological difference rather than a cultural one, I simply don’t believe that there is truly no intersection at which beliefs of Judaism and Christianity meet. Looking at the bigger picture; However, I do see the point that is being made by Neusner and other like minded scholars.
Reading the ideas and beliefs of Jacob Neusner, it definitely made me take a hard look at the argument he is making. I had always seen Christianity as stemming from Judaism and forming to the teachings of Jesus. As people began to convert to Judaism, there were the four groups of Jewish Christianity that had different beliefs (Long, 2018). The groups had different ideas of what beliefs they felt were important. This leads me to connect Judaism and Christianity at their beginnings. Where I see the biggest disconnect was how they chose to worship. This does not mean that they have no intersection for me. Judaism is about living God’s will in life, while Christians are living for salvation. Christians are also living their lives for God while they are on this earth. God has given us direction on how we should live and treat those around us. To me, this is living for God now and in doing so, we are working towards the ultimate goal of salvation in His Kingdom. In Romans 14 verse 8, we are told that we live for the Lord, and die for the Lord. “For if we live, we live to the Lord, and if we die, we die to the Lord. So then, whether we live or whether we die, we are the Lord’s.” This is where I think Neusner is wrong. We are connected through our actions and way of life here on earth.
Reading the ideas and beliefs of Jacob Neusner, it definitely made me take a hard look at the argument he is making. I had always seen Chrisitanity as stemming from Judaism and forming to the teachings of Jesus. As people began to convert to Judaism, there were the four groups of Jewish Christianity that had different beliefs (Long, 2018). The groups had different ideas of what beliefs they felt were important. This leads me to connect Judaism and Christianity at their beginnings. Where I see the biggest disconnect was how they chose to worship. This does not mean that they have no intersection for me. Judaism is about living God’s will in life, while Christians are living for salvation. Christians are also living their lives for God while they are on this earth. God has given us direction on how we should live and treat those around us. To me, this is living for God now and in doing so, we are working towards the ultimate goal of salvation in His Kingdom. In Romans 14 verse 8, we are told that we live for the Lord, and die for the Lord. “For if we live, we live to the Lord, and if we die, we die to the Lord. So then, whether we live or whether we die, we are the Lord’s.” This is where I think Neusner is wrong. We are connected through our actions and way of life here on earth.
It is hard to think of Judaism and Christianity as separate religions, nor do I completely understand how Neusner comes to the conclusion that the two never interact. They do, on so many levels. For instance, the Torah is in the Old Testament of the Christian Bible today, and many New Testament characters often cite and talk about the Torah. More importantly, the prophecies in the Torah are completed in the Bible. There are some differences, however, such as the Torah being written in Hebrew, nothing being lost in translation like in the copied, translated versions of the Bible, and how the Torah does not have everything included within it like the Bible. On the other hand, though the Jews and Jewish-Christianity may not see eye-to-eye, their religions are closely connected. Not one religion knows more about their faith than the other, and that can be seen through the many denominations, which is why I think it is important for each denomination, for each religion connected to God (and God alone), to discuss their beliefs openly about Him, to be better connected in our worship in Him. In other words, exploring different cultures and beliefs can truly improve your relationship with them and Culture is an important aspect, and it is what binds us together.
I love the verse Galatians 3:28, which states, “There is neither Jew nor Gentile, neither slave nor free, nor is there male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus” (Galatians 3:28). This ties them all together, giving everyone a chance to turn to Jesus, to the fully Trinity of God. All in all, this means they were once separate and can now be one, which just shows how much different Judaism is from Christianity, yet Christianity seems to have been birthed from Judaism. On the note of Jews and Christians, however, I can see how they become individual, too. While Jews live the will of God in life, Christians live for salvation. Jews do not believe God can take human form, while Christians center their belief around it. Therefore, while it is hard to think of Judaism and Christianity as two separate religions, I do believe there are individual as much as they are interconnected. While Christianity would not have been manifested if it were not for Judaism, the truth is we should not be seeing Judaism as just a history for Christianity but rather see the culture as a present thing, something that has not yet ended. So, I believe Jews and Christians are no doubt separate, but they are also thoroughly interconnected.